Chapter 13 - SORTING THE FLAK & THE CHAFF

Mr. Grimminger's flak battery information was probably the most definitive data received from any source in the search. The data described the detail of location for the three aircraft in the incident, plus one more crash in the Merano area to the west of the Sarntal region. The German flak unit reports were considered highly reliable. The tasks ahead were primarily, authentication of harware items as P-38 artifacts, and identification of local residents familiar with the locations described in the flak reports and hopefully who were in the area at the time and with some recall of the event. At Bill Mays' suggestion, Diana also wrote letters to her congress-person and to the U.S. ambassador to Italy to make them aware of the search effort in case their influence might be needed to authorize an official recovery effort. Paolo's hardware artifacts were wheels, pressure tank pieces, gun parts/shells, etc. The odd shaped part recovered by Christoph and Inga at the Pluner farm needed further description. Authentication of the pieces required some P-38 harware expertise. The part recovered at the Pluner farm had its recovery location most precisely identified. Jim re-entered the whirlwind that Diana had been skillfully managing.

March 2, 2000

Hi Diana--

Got home tonight & collected 20# mail, 18 recorded telecons, & 93 email messages! You've been on a real merry-go-round, almost started a war, made peace & setup a Wisner NATO! I feel like I've just walked into the final chapter of an epic movie! Tomorrow I'll have to sort through your messages & see what my homework is. I just hope the hoards of investigators swarming over the Sarn valley & hills don't meddle so much with the evidence that the Euro-CIL can't put the puzzle back together. You've been through the wringer---tell me your first order of business.

Jim ----------------------------------------------

Diana welcomed the added support and introduced Jim to the art of diplomacy.

March 3, 2000

Hooray!!! I'm so glad you're back!

I just sent you a copy of Inga's latest. Looks like Paolo is still barking up the wrong tree, and I'll set him straight. But from the tone of Inga's letter, I won't forward it to him verbatim. She's still very hostile to the idea that a reporter might be investigating for other than altruistic reasons. And I still don't care, as long as we get the truth. I don't know what the first order of business is. There's been so much going on, I've almost lost track. I get the idea from Bill Mays last email that EU Command has been notified that we've possibly hit paydirt, so I assume we're waiting for confirmation on some part numbers before they do an investigation. Perhaps when Bill gets back to home base we'll know more. Lowell Twedt's IDPF finally came, and I found his son (another Bill). He's a keno dealer (actually higher up than that, but I don't know what else to call him) in Reno, NV. He doesn't have email, but his son does, so I've opened that channel of communication. The IDPF doesn't provide any more information than my uncle's does -- in fact, even less, because there was nothing of his found after the crash. Bill Twedt was under the impression that Lowell had vanished without a trace. His grandmother, like mine, never gave up hope that he'd be returned, so I guess I'm doing this for two mothers of pilots now. Bill was six when his father died, so he doesn't remember him much at all. Lowell was in the service all along, so he was gone more than he was home.

That's all for now. I don't want to add to your mountain of email. Once you wade through it, give me your take on where we are. Inga did a drawing of the piece she found with the serial number on it and faxed it to me. Jack and I are in process of getting a better piece of scanner software, so I haven't been able to scan it for you. I also got a nice long letter from Mr. Grimminger, the airwar historian in Augsburg, Germany. I haven't been able to scan that, either. It's so long that with my old scanning software the files would be too huge to cope with. He also provided a very detailed map of the area with the sites marked. I should be able to get those to you Monday. Again, I'm glad you're back -- the ship has a rudder again.

D ----------------------------------------

Inga added more substance to the location debate. Mr. Grimminger's detailed map was going to add the framework on which to resolve the debate.

March 3, 2000

Dear Diana,

concerning the crashsite near Garmesegg - i.e. the place where our reporter is searching for a Lightning - I have another confirmation that he is wrong. I knew already from several sources and eye-witnesses that it was a BOMBER which crashed near Garmesegg above Astfeld. Now Keith Bullock ,whom I asked as a bomber crash expert, was helpful again: He has sent to me a letter by another eye witness of the Garmesegg crash which was a BOMBER, was in April 1945 and from which 9 men could escape with parachutes. I called this man and got exactly the same information. As I wrote to you recently I had the same story by an eye witness at Aberstückl, also the 9 parachutes.

Now I am looking forward to have revealed the numbers found by Christoph and me - and I am glad that I am, for the second time, able to help our reporter while he is jubilating on a wrong track. I would call this cooperation. Again: It was a BOMBER which crashed at Garmesegg (reporter's site a). It was a bomber which crashed at Weißenbach near Pens (his site c?). And there were 3 Lightnings to crash near Aberstückl ("his" site b which is Christoph's and my only site, confirmed by German Flak-Reports and by the diary of my German Flak-member). Next week I'll be mostly present (except Monday when I have to go to Munich), if Mr. Mays wants to get in contact. Sorry, I am not able to open the pictures belonging to your last message. Have to upgrade my RAM. Damned computers! They never can get enough.

Best regards

Inga -----------------------------------------

Paolo continued to vigorously pursue his leads and to add more hardware items to the puzzle. He forwarded photos of hardware items he had encountered as he contacted various individuals who possessed them or knew of their existence. Specific sources and/or locations of discovery were not very precisely defined. In many casers there were part numbers showing----but were they from a P-38? Some informed expertise was needed to lend any real significance to the objects.

March 3, 2000

Bolzano, Friday 3rd, 10 pm

Greatings all.

Always awaiting with great suspence your confirmations, here are some News from my "investigation agency". - in attach I send you the picture with the inscriptions (Ae18) of one of the metallic pieces (Ae17) we discovered some days ago at Garmisegg, crash-site a). An expert could let almost the whole inscription re-emerge; only some numbers are not easily legible. I hope you can read it, but in every case I will give you a description of the inscriptions I could read, so that you can receive an indirect confirmation of what you personally can see. It should be part of an engine, 'cause it's written "CARBURETOR". Hey Bill, you were looking for some engine parts, werent' you?!? On the left side there is a vertical inscription: "AIR FLOW" contained into an arrow which goes up. Then it's written "PAT NO. 2.286.479" Then we have six lines which are, from the top to the bottom: (I will undeline the not legible numbers or words)

F??TER CARBURETOR AIR SPECIFICATION NO. AN-F-30 TYPE ??????????????? MFGR'S PART NO. 32P-1457 CONTR. NO. H535 AC 40033 FARR COMPANY - TYPE 68AF-2

This object it's still in my possession for further investigations, if needed. - Next Monday I'll receive the answer from another expert, who is still examining another remain which has a lot of inscriptions. It will cost me quite a lot, but I hope it will be worthy.

- Diane, I know an air/war expert. If you had received the pictures that Inga should have taken from the remain she has founded near Aberstuckl/Sonvigo, please send it to me and I will let it examine,too.

- Yesterday I went to Sarntal and came back with some positive results. Now I'm quite sure about the three different crash-sites. One is at Garmisegg, another near Penserjoch/Passo Pennes, the last at Kirchberg near Aberstuckl/Sonvigo. It won't be possible to reach the second and the third crash-sites until May or June, because of ice and snow. No paths are reachable. In theory. If I'd received a confirmation of the serial numbers, I'll try to go there, without caring about the risks. So, it's up to you. Diane, I'd really like to see the map you've received from Mr. Grimminger, to check out if his locations are the same of mine. In case, you could fax the map (to) my fax at the newspaper.

- I spoke to the farmer who still has the two wheels and who could "find" the machine-gun. He told me, he will try to get some photos or the serial numbers. In this case, I only have to wait and hope. Yesterday he gave to me another bullet, which calibre - I let it examine by another expert... - is .50 US Browning M2 which has a cartridge of 99,2 mm and a calibre of 12,96 mm. I checked a war-book: this is the calibre used by the P-38s, but also by many other WWII planes. According to "my" expert, it comes from a machine-gun called Mod. Brownig M2 or, in another version, M2 HB (Heavy Barrel). In attach you will receive a sketch, so that someone could tell me if it's the right one. In this case, I'll show the sketch to the farmer, hoping he'll recognize it. He said that once in 1944 there were found more than 100 bullets: every five of them, there was a tracer bullet.

- another important information from this farmer: he can remember a tank, which was about 2,5 - 3 meter long. It was founded next to the crash-site in Penserjoch and it wasn't the only one. His uncle used it for many years as a bathtub... It was made by zincate steel. No way to find it at present... It could be one of the typical dropping tank of P-38's.

ciao

Paolo ----------------------------------

Diplomatically, Diana threaded her way through the findings and assumptions from Paolo and Inga. She let Paolo know of the differences in opinion and sought other views.

March 3, 2000

Paolo, I'll be able to scan the map and send it to you Monday or Tuesday. A fax won't be detailed enough. Same with the image Inga sent me. She drew a rough sketch of a part at Aberstueckl. I haven't received any photos from her yet. I'm confirming some information Inga just gave me about Garmisegg and Penserjoch. She thinks they were bomber crashes, not P-38s at those two locations. Her information comes from a British air war historian who lives in Austria, and I'm emailing him now to confirm that information. You may want to hold off on spending any more money on restoring the parts from those two sites until I verify that information. Your photos came through beautifully, and it looks like a good find, anyway. I'll let you know after I hear from Keith Bullock about those two sites.

Diana ---------------------------------------

The search action was moving at a fierce pace & Jim had to quickly come up to speed after his two week absence. He had to put over 100 past emails into perspective and to phase in the current flood of messages.

March 3, 2000

Hi Diana--

I haven't surrounded the whole plot yet, but I think the competitive frenzy is getting out of hand. ……………… & I think that we need to slow down the action to keep from contaminating the possible evidence. I will reply to him (Paolo) congratulating him on the great photos & tell him I will proceed to work with P-38 knowledgeable people to identify what we can. Over the weekend I will read & stitch together the info created while I've been out of the loop. I want to figure out how to jump on this fast moving roller coaster without upsetting things. I am very interested in seeing your map data & the message from Mr. Grimminger. I am also interested in knowing Keith Bullock's participation. When I wrote him a while back, he said he had no time to deal with our search as he was only interested in bomber crash sites. I think I will also go back to Peter Righi to ask for the Sarnvalley tourist data he promised a while back. It may help to put the hand drawn map data in perspective.

Jim ----------------------------------

One of the first tasks Jim concentrated on was to seek some expertise to identify and authenticate the hardware found in the Sarntal region. He had a real active expert in mind. Bob Cardin was reconstructing the 'Glacier Girl', a P-38 recovered from the ice flows of Greenland. It was one of the 1st Fighter Group aircraft lost during the flight to Europe as part of Operation Bolero in 1942.

March 4, 2000

Hi Bob--

You were a guest speaker at our 1st Fighter Association a while back. You also may recall that you assisted us in identifying the P-38 nose strut recovered from Carl Hoenshell's crash site in Bulgaria. Could we send you a few email pix of some aircraft parts we have recovered from another crash site near Bolzano, Italy in hopes of identifying them as P-38 parts? Our current search is for the crash site of Bill Wisner, a 1st Ftr. Group pilot who was lost on a mission on October 20, 1944. Three P-38's went down in a combination flak & collision incident. We are conducting the search at the request of Bill's niece, Diana Dale. Thank you for your consideration,

Best regards,

Jim Graham ----------------------------------

Bright & early Monday morning Bob emailed that he would be happy to help out, so Jim fired off a set often photos of Paolo's hardware finds. Bob messaged back the tentative identification of several wheel & tank parts as likely P-38 parts. Jim FAXed Bob the sketch of the large part that Inga & Christoph had retrieved at the Weger farm. Bob came back with a guess that it was the supercharger housing of a P-38. He wanted a photo of the part to make a more positive identification. That would take awile to have Inga obtain & mail as she didn't have a scanner at the time. So on to other tasks. Jim dispatched a couple of messages to the search crews in Italy to assure them that the U. S. contingent was reading their mail and to move toward an orderly sorting of the data gathered. More to the point---to let Jim & Diana get organized!

March 5, 2000

Hi Paolo--

I could hardly wait to get back online & see what had happened in our search. You certainly have been busy and with lots of information to provide. Your photos are excellent. I am contacting several sources I know with access to P-38 drawings and part information. I will provide them with your photos and the inscription information. I have the messages out, so we'll see if I hear from them this week. The best sources are busy people, so they may not be too quick to respond.

I am anxious to get a good map of the detailed locations for the crashes that you have identified. We know that 3 P-38's crashed in the region that day & our problem will be to determine if the crash sites you have found are of P-38's and if so, which site is which. I doubt very much that any 2 of our P-38's would have crashed very close to each other, even though they all started down from the same point in the sky. In your opinion, do you think that the three sites you have identified could be each of the three airplanes we are interested in? Since Olson survived, we are not quite as interested in his crash site as for the Wisner & Twedt airplanes.

For each of the three P-38's we have the unique serial numbers for the airplane itself, the two engines, and all of their 50 caliber machine guns and there 20 mm cannons. Of course, if we could find any of those, we would be absolutely sure of the plane's identity. Part #'s on other parts will determine if they came from a P-38, but not which one. Each P-38 had two engines, four 50 caliber machine guns and one 20 mm cannon. It is important that the precise location & situation of each part you find should be marked or accurately noted, because if we do determine the site is one of the P-38's we are looking for, the US Army team which would seek permission to examine the site, would want to know all the detailed information they could get. In particular, if any human body parts are located, they should be left in the place found so that they don't have the forensic evidence contaminated.

Bill May, who is an American working in Bulgaria and a very great help in our search there last year for another pilot, is travelling to Stuttgaart this week and hopes to get down to the Bolzano area on his return. We hope he can contact you to discuss your findings. He worked with the US Army team members in Bulgaria to excavate remains of our pilot & plane there, so he is very knowledgeable on how they go about it. We sure appreciate all of your effort in our search and hope it all turns out successful for all of us. Maybe we can all have a gathering near the crash site(s) to get to know each other in person and to celebrate the efforts of everyone that has helped. The Wisner & Twedt families will be very grateful if we can successfully locate the crash sites & remains of there long lost relatives.

In the meantime, we've still got lots to do to get to that point. It may take a year or more to piece it all together, so we need to be patient & careful not to overlook something or to jump to false conclusions. I'm glad to be back online & help out. We hope you will let all of the local people who have offered information know that we are very appreciative of their interest and there time in supporting the search. Your story should certainly include that thought. We think that many new friendships result from these team efforts. We're standing by for new developments. Let us know the questions you need answered to aid the search.

Best regards,

Jim -----------------------------------

After reviewing all of the email messages that exploded during the two weeks of his absence, Jim decided that things needed to be sorted out for clarity and significance---at least for his own understanding.

March 8, 2000

Subject: Stop the music

Hi everyone--

I think it may be time for all of us to 'stop the music' & sort this 'dance' out! I can't speak for Diana, but my head is swimming with various names of places (& over there in the Tyrol, places each seem to have at least two names) and more crash sites than the airplanes we are looking for. The map from Mr. Grimminger is a good place to start sorting things out. If each of you has one, I would suggest that you draw a grid of lines on it at 1 cm intervals. I started at the upper left hand corner. I drew horizontal lines and numbered them #1 through #25 with the line at the top border being #0. Then I drew vertical lines and lettered them A through S with the 'A' line spaced 1cm from the left edge of the map image. With this grid I find Aberstuckl to be almost directly on the 9G intersection. From Mr. Grimminger, the map is a 1:200,000 scale, therefor 1cm on the map is equal to 2 km (100,000 cm= 1 km).

We seem to have four sites identified in Mr. Grimminger's letter: #1 North slope of the Kirchberg at Aberstuckl (near map grid 9G) #2 Messner Basai, 9-10 Km North of Sarntheim (can't find, but must be close to 8H or 9H on the map grid) #3 East of Rabenstein (near map grid 8H or 8I) #4 Kesselberg (Monte Catino) (near map grid 11F or 11G)

We know only 3 P-38's crashed in the area about 11:30 on the morning of October 20, 1944. Yes, there were 4 P-38's in trouble, but we know that Capt. Elliott was able to make it safely to Ancona. It is my opinion that the Flakgruppe reports may not have realized that Elliott's plane did not actually crash. Mr. Grimminger's #2 & #3 sites may be one and the same as far as actual crashes are concerned. It looks like sites 1, 3 & 4 are within a circle about 10 km in diameter with the center at Aberstuckl.

Paolo, you have talked of crash sites at Garmisegg and Penserjoch. I can find Penser Joch at map grid of about 4K, but I can't locate Garmisegg. Can you give us the map grid for it? Penser Joch looks like about 12 km from Aberstuckl. Could we all check out the locations we have been talking about and reply with any corrections to my assumptions or recommendations to make our messages better understood?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

To answer some of your questions, Paolo:

When Bob Cardin said 'not positive' about photo Ae11, he meant that he can't be sure of his guess that the ring is the reduction gear from the nose of an Allison engine (which P-38's had), but he believes it could be. We must understand that there are no full size paper drawings for the P-38 anymore & that Bob probably just has microfilmed drawings & parts lists. He is much too busy a man to thoroughly search through all of the microfilmed records, so he is basing his judgements on his experience in fully restoring the 'Glacier Girl' P-38 which crash landed in Greenland in 1942.

As for the 'later report': With the mission reports of the 1st FG, there is a supplementary report written by a pilot of a bomber in the 463rd BG which was flying east of the Bolzano area at the time of the P-38 crash incident. They were on there way to a Regensburg target. As in the letter from Mr. Grimminger, the 1st FG & 82nd FG (92 P-38's) were assigned to support the B-17's of the 99th BG & 463rd BG. I know from the 1st FG mission plan that they expected to rendezvous with the bombers in the Innsbruck area. The 99th BG may have been ahead of the 463rd BG as the 1st FG P-38's, flying much faster than the bombers would have caught up to them shortly after passing the Bolzano area. The 82nd FG may have been assigned to eventually catch the 463rd BG for their cover, but I don't have records for the 82nd FG. In any case, the bomber groups would were probably East of the Bolzano area to avoid the heavy flak concentration.

The observation of the bomber pilot was stated as follows by the report: "On October 20, 1944, five miles northeast of Bolzano at 1115 hours, 3 P-38's were lost due to a mid-air collision. Lt. Knapp, pilot of a B-17, (772nd BS, 463rd BG) reports two chutes were seen to open below the wreckage, from a distance. The incident was originally reported as a B-24 blowing up, but further interrogation reveals that Lt. Knapp did not identify the explosion as any type of aircraft but the observation of the falling wreckage and the two chutes was the approximate time of the collision of the 3 P-38's."

As you see, the report is "from a distance" & a report of a very busy pilot. The report only suggests the possibility of two chutes. A good friend of mine who is now dead, has said in a letter to Bill Wisner's family that he was on the October 20 mission & after the collision he followed one of the spiralling planes down until it crashed. He believed it was Bill Wisner's plane & he said that he did not see the pilot bail out. We don't know much of what Twedt's plane did on the way to the ground. We do know that Olson bailed out & was slightly injured & went to Stalag 7A.

I can't recall the parachute colors---I never used one, but I think they were white as there were lots of scarfs made from the used/damaged ones.

I agree with you that we must eventually put together a file of all of the significant findings of our search for the EU Command. They want very well substantiated information though and not our speculations. I put together about a 150 page report that I sent to them for the Hoenshell search which Bill Mays worked on in Bulgaria. I have all of the mission reports, MACR's and between Diana and myself, the various family & government reports dealing with Bill Wisner's case. We need to carefully identify the various witnesses that have told you & Mair & Inga their stories and to carefully document the location of recovered plane parts as well as to get the witnesses to define as closely as possible where they believe any burial sites may have been. Certainly if there is a hidden machine gun somewhere there, it would be very helpful in determining which crash site was which. I hope I have answered some of the open questions……………………. I will await your answers & recommendations.

Good night all---

Jim --------------------------------------

Mr. Grimminger's map was of an ideal scale to put the overall territory of the search into a good visual perspective. It covered Bolzano, Ritten and the entire Sarntal region. Inga helped out with a map of the Sarn Valley that detailed the potential crash areas to a much finer resolution (6 times better). She also sent photos of the large hardware piece that she had sketched earlier. The photos were forwarded to Bob Cardin to analyze. Bob came back with a resounding confirmation that the piece was a P-38 turbo supercharger housing! The map that Inga FAXed, with its great detail at roughly ½ mile to the inch, showed theelevations, streams, roads and villages that allowed reasonable estimates of the crash locations which Mr. Grimminger had described to be within about 3 miles of each other. The supercharger housing was found on the Pluner farm on a hillside near a rushing creek some ¾ mile to the East of the valley road. The team now had a site that was closely associated with verified P-38 hardware and a resident who recalled the crash. It was about time to call in the U.S. Army mortuary affairs agency to officially locate and examine the true crash site. The big question remained---was it the crash site for Wisner or Twedt? The Olson crash site was one of the two identified by Mr. Grimminger to the southwest about 2 to 3 miles. Diana was elated.

March 9, 2000

Inga, you and Mair did it! By now you probably have received the email from Bob Cardin (forwarded by Jim) that confirms the part you found is from a P-38. That's exactly what we needed to get EU Command onto the trail. Thank you SO much! I wish I knew what will happen next. I guess we wait for the snow to thaw so the investigators can go in and figure out who crashed where. However, the story of the ID bracelet makes me hope against hope that my uncle fell onto Jakob's land, because I'm sure Jakob will protect the site. (Did you enjoy Bob's comment about the third picture? It was the one of Jakob holding the saw.) Please thank him for me and ask him to hold the part until the U.S. authorities can get a look at it. I have no idea when that will be or what that will entail, but I'm sure we'll find out soon enough. Of course, once the government gets involved, things will move a lot more slowly. In the meantime, if you or Christoph or Jakob need anything from me, please let me know.

With enormous gratitude,

Diana ------------------------------------------

* SEE FIGURE 5 -- P-38 SUPERCHARGER (FOUND BY CHRISTOPH AND INGA AT THE PLUNER FARM)